Carol Marzouk - How to create a healthy harmonious workplace

Time is precious and so are our pets, so time with our pets is extra precious. That's why we started Dutch. Dutch provides 24/7 access to licensed vets with unlimited virtual visits and follow-ups for up to 5 pets. You can message a vet at any time and schedule a video visit the same day. Our vets can even prescribe medication for many ailments, and shipping is always free. With Dutch, you'll get more time with your pets and year-round peace of mind when it comes to their vet care. Hi everyone, it's Bill Black, the exit coach from the Exit Coach Radio show. You know, one of the biggest questions I get on the show is what exactly goes into a business exit plan and when should I start creating mine? Well, I always tell people that the best time to start was 5 years ago, but the next best time is now because you never know when you might need it. So we put together a free report that describes what an exit plan is and what you should know. You can get it free by texting exit plan with no spaces to 442-22. That's exit plan to 44222. Again, text exit plan to 44222. Welcome to the Exit Coach Radio show, the show for baby boomer business owners who are looking for cutting edge information as they plan their 3 to 10 year business succession and exit. Every week we interview top professional advisors for. The best tips, strategies, and precautions so you can be well planned. And don't miss our one minute exit coach tip of the day on exit coachradio.com. And now here's your host, the exit coach, Bill Black. Hey everyone, thanks so much for joining me today. It's a pleasure to have you with me, and we have a great lineup today. My first guest is Carol Marzuk, and she is with Leadership and Soul. She is the CEO of that organization, and Carol's going to talk about why there's low trust and destructive conflict. The workplace and what to do about it. So this is, this is perfect for our listening audience. If you're a business owner, I'm sure every once in a while you, you have a conflict in the workplace, and Carol's going to tell us what to do about that. So Carol, welcome and thank you so much for joining me today. Thank you for having me, Bill. Carol, before we get into this, this interesting topic, can you share a little bit about you and your background and how you got into this field? Absolutely. Thank you for asking. So I, uh, I've been doing this in one way or another for almost 28 years, Bill. I would say that. It all started um because I'm the 5th of 5 girls and as you can imagine my household was just full of conflict and um. Um, my, my parents were from, you know, different parts of the world and, um, different value systems and And so, you know, I was actually born in Mexico City. My dad was from Iraq and um being Jewish, he had to leave and he, he ended up going to Bombay and eventually made his way to England and then the US and my mom's side from Syria and Italy, also Jewish, they had to leave and so they ended up in Mexico City. And you know, my mom's side of the family, my dad's side of the family, very, very different value systems. And um then they had the, you know, us 5, and we ended up here in the US and um and coming here, you know, the idea was to raise us the way that we would have been raised in Mexico City, but in, you know, an American kind of values, uh, environment. And so, um, Yeah, there was a lot of conflict that, you know, that I had to navigate in between, between my sisters, between my parents, um, and really between, you know, me and myself. So, so I got really good at it. Was it conflict or survival? Or both, I would say I would say both. That's amazing. So, well that, that well suited you for, for what you do with leadership and soul. Tell us a little bit about this, this organization that you've developed, leadership and soul and what you do and what type of clients you, you help. Well, leadership in Seoul. So the reason why I named it Leadership in Seoul is because, um, being in corporate for over two decades, I, I worked with a lot of leaders, high-level executives, um, and I saw many times, Bill, that they would say the right things in public, they would, you know, um, the optics would be there, but behind closed doors. They were doing incredibly destructive things to their team and um and to individuals on the team, and they were completely misaligned with the message they were giving out in public. And um and, you know, seeing it, experiencing it firsthand, this passion grew in me to make sure that People didn't go through that, um, if they didn't need to. And so I wanted to, you know, have a Have a business, an organization that would help executives and their staff align so that they don't feel like they just don't want to go to work, that the environment is so toxic because there's so much misalignment there and, and I was tired of seeing leaders go to work without their soul and um and I, I felt very strongly that you can be a leader, you can. You can be vulnerable and, and, you know, and still lead with soul. And that was, um, and that's when I decided to, you know, create a, an organization that allowed Or um, you know, high-level executives to do that and, and also lawyers. I I work with a lot of partners and law firms, um, and, you know, I'm seeing the same kind of thing and, and it's absolutely possible to lead with soul. Well, that's, that's good to know. I mean, I, I would hope that that people could get on the right track. What do you think the primary reason that, um, owners get off track in the first place in that category is? I think one of the biggest reasons is that they're not properly prepared for the role. And, um, and so what happens is they feel that they have to pretend to be somebody else, and they create these layers of, uh, or facades, I should say, that um disallow other people from seeing their authentic self. And they feel that it's this, you know, protection and, um, and so what happens is because they don't act from a place of um authenticity, they create a lack of trust and um you know, and, and when there's distrust, there's poor communication and, and we can't have constructive conflict. And when you can't have constructive conflict, you can't really have commitment. And when you can't have commitment, you really can't hold people accountable. And when you can't hold people accountable, you can't really get the kinds of results that you want in your organization. Can do you think owners can um overcome that lack of uh soul or lack of lack of trust? I mean, most, most owners that I work with, Carol, they, they need to hold Some things close to the vest, if you will, they just feel like they, it's, you know, they always say it's lonely at the top, right? It's, it's difficult to to let some things out because you don't want to worry employees. You don't want to worry, for instance, your spouse, so you don't want to worry other people about if the if the company's not doing well, you're going to have problems. How can they, how can they deal with some of these issues without feeling like they're, they're giving up. Uh, too much. Yeah, that's a really great question, Bill. So part of being a great leader is knowing when to be vulnerable, when to give information, and when to not. It's knowing when to make the quick decisions and when to take a moment and pause and think about what you're doing, right? It's, it's being able to decipher, um, you know, how you should behave and act and communicate in different types of situations. I think, um, I think that one of the biggest issues in the workplace is that we tend to say, and I'm sure you've heard this, is, you know, leave your emotions at the door and leave your personal life at the door, and, and the truth is that we're human beings and no matter how much people want to do that, they bring with them their whole life experience and, and let's just say that day's experience, right? We can't just hang up a coat with all of our emotions and all of our You know, um, issues that we're, that we're handling and just focus solely on work because we're just not robots. Um, and so, I, I think that one of the primary, um, one of the primary issues that can be fixed and that they can do. is to stop shying away from the, the people side that, that, um, that human side that people bring to work and really start addressing it. And I think, you know, I think it starts with addressing conflict between teammates in a timely and appropriate manner instead of just pretending it doesn't exist, sticking our heads in the sand and hoping it goes away. Because that grows, right? And, and that eventually will turn into poor behavior and um poor performance. Um, and, and I see also because of that, we tend to not own our errors, our mistakes, you know, our leadership issues, um, and so, you know, I think there are a lot of things that, that leaders do that, that they can change, that they can, that they can fix. Um, and even just being able to look at themselves and, and being honest with themselves and seeing how they might be inconsistent with how they treat employees, how they might be participating in the very behavior that they want to eradicate, um, you know, being able to do that, I think is, you know, it's difficult, but it's possible. It it is, it's a difficult topic. It's, it's hard to get your head around sometimes, um, of course, uh, a lot of businesses out there are family businesses, and there's, there's going to be some kind of conflict that's not only, um, contained in the workplace, it, it was carried over from a family situation. So tell us about what kind of clients do you have and do you tend to work with, Carol? What do they look like? So I have um different types of clients. The, the first grouping, I'll say are boards of directors. They tend to be nonprofit boards of directors and they bring me in uh not only for board development, but also to work uh on their annual strategic sessions, um, and I stay with them the whole year for no extra charge to make sure that those initiatives that we work on, um, are, you know, actually coming to fruition. Uh, the second type of client bill is the CEO. Or um executive in in an organization where, you know, they're either having toxic executives um affect their staff and their organization, or, um, they, they're just, their team isn't working as effectively as they should, um, and, you know, partners and law firms fall into that category. And then my other type of clients are the clients that have really great organizations already that are um leading with, with vulnerability and um they're doing the right things and they're worried about losing their top performers or their high potentials, and so they want a leadership academy um that is custom suited to their organization. And to the gaps in their leadership so that those people have a reason to say so that they feel that there's a higher purpose to what they're doing and that they can affect the organization and innovate in a way that's, you know, that's interesting and valuable for them. Can you expand on that that terminology? I like the sound of that. The leadership academy. What is it and how does somebody get get to A developing something like that. What are the steps? Yeah, so a leadership academy, um, typically what I do is I go into the organization and the, the average number that I accept is 12 and so we can do different groups, but I, I like a group of 12 and I do this every month. We meet for 4 hours and they get one on one coaching and group coaching, and every month when they leave our session. They are, they are tasked with, and this is something they come up with. Um, they are tasked with doing something to improve the organization and or themselves in that organization as a leader, um, and they're held accountable for that with, you know, the group holds them accountable and then I hold them accountable. And so the next time we meet, the next month, We talk about what they did the previous month, and we do this for a year. And so by the end of the year, Bill, we have, on average, 12 people making 12 improvements. many times innovative improvements to the organization. And so, you know, if you do the math, it's about 144 improvements to an organization that they wouldn't have otherwise had and they have increased their loyalty in these folks. They have increased their engagement and and they're propelling the whole. Organization forward. That's incredible. That sounds really terrific. So there are monthly meetings, like you said, 4 hours each, and and he said each individual gets one on one and group coaching, so they do they get together as a group and for a period of time and then break off into a single. Meetings with you, is that how that works? Yes, and they also have access to me at any time. So they not only have meetings with me, but they can also call me at any time just like all of my clients can and say, hey, listen, I'm I'm, you know, running into this obstacle or this challenge and you know, what should we do moving forward? And so I, I coach them through it, um, and it's all included and, and uh it's, it's wonderful to see. Just a change in their level of engagement because, you know, these high performers really want to make a difference, especially the millennials. That's great, and I really think that's a terrific, you know, communication sometimes is lacking, especially in busy times these days in businesses and Uh, everybody wants their voice to be heard. I hear that a lot from people that say, you know, nobody's ever asked me this type of stuff before, and that's, that sounds like a terrific program, and it's called the Leadership Academy, right? Mhm. Yes, love it. OK. And do you work with, I've heard you say something in meetings where we attend as networkers and provisors, which is makes you a very well networked person, Carol, by the way. So you're you're a tremendous asset, I know, for your clients to to refer in people of all walks of life in the professional space. But I've heard you say something about when people are throwing chairs. Um, uh, what, what, what kind of situations have you walked into where, where it's, it's, give us an example of a situation where things were bad and you, you came in and made everything better. OK. Um, well, thank you for asking. The rowing chairs actually did happen. Um, there was a partner in a law firm who had asked me to work with another, um, partner in, in the law firm, and, and when I met with him, um, he really wasn't at a stage where he was coachable, and he didn't have the time and, and didn't really want to change. And, and so I politely said, you know, I You know, I, I think the timing is, is not right, etc. and And so about a month, a month and a week later, um, I get another call, and now this person has taken a chair in a conference room and literally thrown it across the room and almost hit an associate. And um and yeah and then now they now they were set up for a lawsuit and. And and he could have been sued several times before that too for several different reasons, but that for some reason had to happen in order for him to realize how bad the situation was and for him to become coachable, and he himself called me and said, Carol, I'm ready, and I started working with him and And I, I take a whole group approach, Bill. So you know, when I'm working with a partner or an executive, I like to work with our whole group because nobody works in an island, nobody lived in an island, and I, I want them, you know, I want their team to realize that he's really or she is really. Actively working to change and to get better, and I want them to support that person. And so I started working with the team and with him as an individual and eventually even worked with the whole staff in in both of the locations in the law firm locations that they had. And now they have, you know, they went from a place of judgment and judging each other and their behavior to a place of not only understanding why other people behave a certain way, but really valuing those differences and, and realizing that, you know, when somebody rubs us the wrong way or when When we feel personally attacked, many times it's not intended that way and that it's just their natural, it's, it's kind of their natural style because of what their motivators are, um, and it's not personal at all. And so now they have a common language and um they're aligned and they can talk about the things that they were holding on to. For 7, this particular law firm, they, some of the people were holding on to stuff for 10 years, some for 7 years, that they couldn't say. And um and so they were now able to have these conversations um that made a huge difference. And, and now they can, you know, now they can even disagree on things and still commit to doing, um, to doing certain things together. It's terrific, and you know, listeners, this is not the kind of thing that you want to probably try on your own to to open up the lines of communication where there might be some hidden hostilities or things. You really need somebody who knows what to do with it, how to guide it, how to help people bring out, you know, what those issues are and then deal with those. And that's where Carol Marzuk comes in. Carol, how do our listeners I get in touch with you to talk about what their situation might be so you can, you can figure out if it's something you might be able to help them with. Well, thank you so much for asking, Bill. So they can call me, they can text me. I'll give you my personal cell phone. It's 714-568-8424. My office line is 951-888-5857. And they can email me at carol@ leadership, the letter N as in Nancy and the word soulsou.com. There are a lot of coaches and trainers out there, but none that I know that that add in both leadership and soul, and Carol, I think that's why you're so special and that's why your clients love you and I really, you know, I've, I've heard. Other advisers that have referred you into business situations that just rave about the outcome. So you're doing a great job. Keep up the good work and thank you so much for sharing this information. You're also, as I'm, as I note. You're also a speaker for Visage worldwide, so if you're listening in your Vistige chair and you you're looking for a great speaker on the topic of of leadership and soul, um, consider Carol. So thank you so much for joining me today. It's been a real pleasure. You're so beautiful, Bill. Thank you for the opportunity and thank you so much. Thank you for listening to Exit Coach Radio. Time is precious and so are our pets, so time with our pets is extra precious. That's why we started Dutch. Dutch provides 24/7 access to licensed vets with unlimited virtual visits and follow-ups for up to 5 pets. You can message a vet at any time and schedule a video visit the same day. Our vets can even prescribe medication for many ailments, and shipping is always free. With Dutch, you'll get more time with your pets and year-round peace of mind when it comes to their vet care.