In this 20 minute interview, Lynn Fulks, Principal Partner of Upstart Group LLC, discusses the tried and true methods er firm uses to help businesses develop effective marketing and branding campaigns. She explains a 3 stage process that requires thought and research (and investment) before resorting to tactics, and why most campaigns are doomed from the start.
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That's SPA CE 80. To match with a licensed therapist today, go to Talkspace.com and enter promo code S80. Welcome to the Exit Coach Radio show, the show for baby boomer business owners who are looking for cutting edge information as they plan their 3 to 10 year business succession and exit. Every week we interview top professional advisors for their best tips, strategies, and precautions so you can be well planned. And don't miss our one minute exit coach tip of the day. On exit coachradio.com. And now here's your host, the exit coach Bill Black. Welcome back, everyone. This show segment is brought to you by the Values Institute. Please visit their website on our website. There's a link there at exitoachradio.com. You'll also find all of our guests highlights and interviews uploaded, so please visit often. My next guest is Lynn Fulks, uh, the principal partner of the Upstart Group LLC in Carlsbad, California. Lynn, are you there? Hi, Bill. How are you today? I'm doing great, thank you so much for having me on your show. Lynn. I've been looking forward to our discussion. We talked on the telephone and um before we get into uh. Some of the the subject matter, we always like to start by getting to know a little bit about our guests. What's your background and how did you get into this particular line of work? Right. Well, I've done my whole career, my whole professional career has been in market. primarily in hardware and software companies, and the last major corporation I worked for was Microsoft Corporation. I held a variety of senior level marketing management positions for Microsoft. OK, and then, uh, when did you get involved with the, uh, Upstart Group and when did you start that? Well, there's a little bit of a backstory because my husband and I decided to take a 2 year sabbatical and we were going to go sailing and that 2 year sabbatical turned into 6.5 years because let me just say that living on a sailboat in the Caribbean is so much fun. I highly recommend it to everybody. Oh, I was going to say maybe there was no wind. We extended that 2 years to 6.5 and when we came back to the states all ready to go back to work, one of my colleagues from Microsoft said, you know, we've always wanted to start our agency. Let's start our agency. And so we did, and Upstart Group is 4 years old now and going strong. So what does Upstart Group do exactly? We are a fractional CMOs for companies, so it's like rent a chief marketing officer or vice president of marketing or even a director of marketing for companies often in the 2 million range and up can't afford or don't need that full-time, fully loaded headcount for that senior strategy position, but But they need the thinking and the work done around their business so we can come in for a period of time, usually around 6 months, 8 months, and build their marketing foundation for them so that more junior marketing managers can can execute on that strategy and and increase the value of the company thus. Excellent idea for a company. Um, are there any particular types of businesses or sizes that you tend to work with? Well, we thought we would, we would start out more with startups because it's so fun. They're so nimble, quick, fast, quick turnaround, very exciting to work with those types of entrepreneurs, but we found that we've been able to to do the most benefit for companies in the 2 million and up range, and actually 5 million and up has been more. The sweet spot for them for us to be able to help them. As far as types of industry, when we started, we were getting lots of referrals from ex-Microsoft colleagues and so with our background in high tech, it's very comfortable for us and we tend to attract high tech to ourselves. That said, it's been so much fun working on so many different industries. Uh, we've had a funeral home, microbrewery, land planners, health service organizations, insurance organizations, executive consulting firms. It's, it's been a lot of fun expanding our marketing knowledge into other industries. So what would prompt a CEO to want to call you in the first place? Generally what happens is that they see that their revenues have flattened over, you know, a period of time. I had a CEO several months ago contacted me and his revenues had been flat for the last several years, just under 5 million gross annual revenue and you know you start a business, these entrepreneurs start a business, and they have, you know, pretty steady growth, and then for some reason at some point they seem to plateau. I have another CEO I was speaking with right before the holiday. And they had plateaued at 10 million and had been stuck there for a year and a half with absolutely no movement and in fact they're now faring a little bit down in in revenue. And when we go in and do a marketing audit, generally what we found is one of two things. Either they've lost touch with where, when, why, how their customer shops for and chooses their product or service. Or they've not been paying attention to their competition, who are doing something new and innovative, either in product service themselves or in their marketing to grab that piece of market share. I see. OK. Uh, when we talked on the telephone, you mentioned something called the three segments of marketing. Could you expand on that just a little bit for us? Sure, so Upstart Group thinks about marketing in 3 pieces, and, and I know most, most newer CEOs think of marketing as the tactics. It's advertising, public relations, it's social media. It's an email marketing campaign. I'm going to send a newsletter out, but but for marketing. Strategy. There's 3 pieces research, foundation, and then tactics and campaigns and those marketing tactics are what I just talked about advertising, PR, etc. and they should come last after you after you've done the other work. So taking a firm's strategic plan for the next 3 to 5 years with the exit strategy. defined and then looking at the business plan for the upcoming year, what goals and objectives do they have outlined for the business in order to achieve their strategic plans we're going to develop a strategic marketing plan to help meet those goals and objectives, and the first step in that is research. So customer research, um, competitive research, market research, uh, developing your SWOT, which is strength, weaknesses, opportunities and threats, and all of that research is data gathering in order to make smart decisions with your resources, which are time, money, and people. So you want to make sure that you use all your resources, most bang for the buck, basically. So research 1st. 2nd step is build your marketing foundation. What we consider marking foundation is primarily the brand, and your brand, most people, when we say brand, they think, oh, it's the logo and my colors and what font I use. Uh, ideally the brand is how you position your company and what messaging you use to your audience segment that you that you defined through research. So brand is positioning, messaging, tagline. Uh, at the very bottom of vision, mission values are the visual elements which are the logo and the colors and the fonts, and those shouldn't even be defined until you've already done positioning, messaging, vision, mission, etc. and all of that again is based on the research that you did. So you've done your research data gathering, you've developed your brand. Uh, the next step in foundation is content development. And that's for website and all the content that you need in order to convince your particular customers why they should choose your product or service instead of your competition. And then the last piece of foundation and uh the past two years we've moved that from tactics into the foundation because we feel it's very important and that is your website. So your marketing foundation is your brand. The content and all of that goes onto your website. So you should look at research and foundations, those three things, brand content and websites. Those two pieces of marketing are investments and, and companies tend to skimp in those areas. when that's the place they need to make investment for for the next 3 to 5 years. It's like setting up your accounting package properly. It's about renting the right retail space or getting your offices set up, getting your IT systems set up. That's investment. If you do the research and the foundation work, then the last piece, which are the marketing tactics in any marketing campaigns. Those become money-making machines. Most companies get straight to tactics. They may have a logo, but they'll get straight to tactics. And at that point, those tactics, advertising PR, etc. they're a business expense. They are not a money market making machine because it's more of the spray and prey approach. So let's do this ad and see if we get any hits. Well, let's do this PR push, you know, we'll issue a press response from that, but without clear definition of who the customer is. Where, when, why, how they shop for the product and differentiating yourself from your competition effectively. You know, random acts of marketing with tactics in campaigns. Lynn, I know that listeners are having an aha moment out there by the by the droves right now. Great stuff. We're talking with Lynn Folks of Upstart Group LLC and Carlsbad. We're going to take a short break and when we come back, we're going to ask Lynn to share a few stories and some tips, ideas, and precautions that you can use. We'll be right back. Whether you run a medium sized business or a major corporation, Harry B. Alexson offers you personalized skilled legal services in several key areas of banking and finance services, mergers and acquisitions, syndications in private equity and commercial real estate law. With more than 20 years' experience, Harry B. Alexson provides you with a large firm partner and resources with boutique firm service and attention. To learn more, simply call Harry B. Alexson at 714-384-6578. At Exitcoachradio.com, we're interviewing over 100 top advisors to get you one minute tips, ideas and precautions so you can be well planned. We upload new content daily at 6 a.m. and 1 p.m. Exitcoachradio.com. Come listen for a minute. Welcome back friends. Just a reminder that to hear highlights of this interview and to listen to all the interviews and highlights of our many past guests, please visit us online at exitcoachradio.com, where we upload new content every day. I'm talking with Lynn folks of the Upstart Group, and Lynn, that was a great first segment. Paul and I were looking at each other going, Oh my gosh, we've been doing it wrong all this time. I'm not sure she can keep it up for a whole another segment here. That was that was too good. We should just end it right there. Well, we certainly can if if you need to. I have to just jump in and say I laughed. I was the engineer. I thought I'd heard it all, but when you said spray and pray, I thought that was a good one. Oh good, I'm glad you all enjoyed that. Well, you know, it's interesting because often in research we, we always ask our client, who are your top three competitors, and they'll tell us who their top 3 competitors are. And then when we get into the customer research piece, we always ask the customers, who else did you look at for this particular product or service, you know, where else did you shop for that? And it's never who. Our client thinks they're their top 3 competitors. Oh, is that right? Exactly. It's very, it's usually very eye opening who your customers consider your competition. OK, so it's, it's important to do that research and like you said, the research and foundation are investments if you want this thing to really work. So Lynn, tell us a couple of stories, if you will, maybe an example of a recent client you helped. What was their situation before you came on the scene and how did you help? Yeah, well, it's it's kind of the same story all along, you know, someone who Particular client who's stuck at 2 million for several years and just can't figure out why they're stuck. They say, oh no, we don't need to do the research piece. We know who our customers are. We know why they shop. We know where they shop, you know, we know our customers persevering, we will not get that research step because sure enough. Talk about some eye openers who the who the customer considered the competition. Our client had a very clear picture of what their differentiation was, you know, why they were different from the competition, but what the customers told us why they purchased that product instead of the competitor's product was completely different than than what our clients thought was the reason people were purchasing the product. So you, you can't say, you know, you can't rest on your laurels with, oh, I know who my customers are and what they want and why they buy from me because what they'll tell you, particularly what they'll tell a third party, and this is really important and and could even be a tip, but um don't do your research yourself. Have a third party even if it's an intern saying, you know, I'm working on a research project or a research firm or a marketing firm, have someone else do the research for you because it's amazing what customers who you talk to on a weekly basis will tell someone, a third party when they know their name and company is not going to be attached to it. You can get very candid comments that way. That is a great tip. Uh, it, it makes a lot of sense, and I think what you're saying makes so much sense. Most entrepreneurs want to skip right to the tactics and let's just get it done, and they don't want to do all the detail work and that's where you all come in is. Uh, especially, you'll, you don't skip steps, right? Well, no, and, and we've had clients, you know, potential clients want us to skip steps, and we'll say, you know what, you're going to be unhappy because we're going to launch an advertising campaign focused it who knows who. You know, in positioning you just randomly, we don't even know that that that's differentiated you from the competition, and you're willing to spend all this money on an advertising campaign when if we did the upfront work instead of that advertising campaign being an expense, it could be a moneymaking machine, you know, returning $2 or more on the dollar investment. So, so that's a precaution I'd say is don't skip steps. Maybe it's a tip. Do you have any other tip tips for our listeners or ideas that they should where they should, um, maybe assess where they are and before they give you a call, what should they be looking at? Sure. um, so, so one thing is our customers change the way they shop and buy products and who their influencers are every several years. I mean, think of. About it, we were not using social media, for instance, 5 years ago to shop for products or to let people influence us on which products to buy or even ask our friends and relatives what product do you use for X, Y, or Z or what service do you use. So there are new tools right now for consumers to shop, so. Plan on budgeting for a research, you should be doing ongoing research through customer service assessments, but a big research work, a brand update and content and website update. you should budget for that every 3 to 5 years minimum because your customers and your competition are going to change. What worked for you 3 years ago maybe not working for you, in fact, hindering you now, which is maybe why your, your sales have leveled off. Yeah, and not only that, but like you say, the, the habits of the consumers, and you, you probably have in your product line many segments of consumers likely are each changing their habits pretty quickly where they go and, and what they rely on for research and information. That's true. And so do their influencers because who influences someone is a whole different position and message that you want to get to the influencers versus what you want to get to the end user. Remember the spice. Old Spice marketing campaign a couple of years ago. It was this gorgeous man and he said, you know, your man may not look like me, but he could smell like me. All the women in the audience remember that ad. That ad was completely focused at the influencer, the one. Not the end user of the products the man. So it's completely different messaging than they would use for the end user. So yeah, you really need to be focused on who you're talking to and what you're telling them in order for them to take action. And the action you want, the influencer to take. to recommend that product. I see. So your, your target market might be the person that's going to influence the person who would ultimately use the product, not necessarily the end user, him or herself. Correct. And it's usually both. I see. OK. That makes a ton of sense, Lynn. Uh, if I were to ask you, uh, what's the best way to get in touch with Upstart Group or to get in touch with you, what would the best way be for that? Yes, you can send me an email at Lynn LYNN@ upstartgroup.com, and feel free to visit our website upstartgroup.com or contact me through the link on your website, Bill. And you told me that you're, you're willing to talk to anyone for a little while about their situation. You're very open to calls and to, ah, ah, get a feel for what a person is doing now and, and very helpful on the phone, so all of our listeners should take advantage of that. Um, what's the best number for them to reach you at? Right, Bill, I'm happy to speak with anyone for up to an hour as a free marketing consult to just hear about their problem and offer any suggestions. My number is 305-393-5880. That's 305-393-5880. Lynn, I want to thank you very much for coming onto the show. It's been a very fascinating interview. I've learned a lot and I'm sure our listeners have as well. Thanks very much for coming onto the show. Bill, thank you so much for having me and have a great rest of day. I've been talking with Lynn Fulks of Upstart Group in Carlsbad and friends that is going to do it for our show today. I want to thank you for listening in. I hope you've learned something that'll help you in some way with future planning. And a big thank you to my guests and our sponsors, and I'd like to thank our station engineer Paul Roberts, who has done his usual outstanding job with the board a little longer than usual. Hey, if they didn't learn something in 3 hours, they're never going to learn it. You had something for everybody today. What a show. It was a potpourri of, of gems of information, that's for sure. And, uh, I want to thank. Talkradio.net for hosting us at their beautiful tech space studios and remember we update content daily, so please visit us often and tell your friends to find us at Exaoachradio.com. We're here to help you, our hero, the private business owner with tips, ideas, and precautions so that you are well planned. Thank you for listening to Exit Coach Radio. It's true that some things change as we get older, but if you're a woman over 40 and you're dealing with insomnia, brain fog, moodiness, and weight gain, you don't have to accept it as just another part of aging. 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