My Employees Are Not Thrilled to Be Back at Work

[Music] hello everyone welcome to the 21 hats podcast I'm your host Lauren Feldman this week our conversation focused on how each of our three business owners is contemplating emerging from the crisis in fact we taped the conversation on Friday morning May 1st as Jay goz was reopening his home and garden store in Chicago we talked about the precautions the risks The Dilemma of asking employees to accept Less in Pay than they were getting in unemployment and the threat of a second Corona virus wave that could bring a second shutdown Jay who took a break from the taping to see whether any customers were actually showing up at his reopen store told us I don't have the luxury of just saying oh I'll tell you what maybe we'll open in 6 weeks 8 weeks I mean there's some point where I'll be out of business this week's 21 hats podcast lineup included Jay goz whose businesses in Chicago include a picture frame shop artist frame service and the home furnishing store Jason home Dana White founder and CEO of paraly Boyd a chain of hair salons based in Detroit and Laura Xander co-founder and CEO of Jimmy beans wool a digital version of a neighborhood yarn shop that is based in Reno Nevada even in Good Times owning and running a business can be a lonely Pursuit our hope is that these weekly conversations will if nothing else let owners know they are not alone in facing these extraordinary challenges if you know a friend who might benefit from this conversation please share it you can subscribe wherever you get podcasts and if you do please review us and rate US it makes a big difference if you have questions or suggestions you can always email them to me my email address is L Feldman at21 hats.com before we get started I'm here with Adam witty who is the founder and CEO of Advantage forbs books which helps entrepreneurs write and publish their own books Adam I know you think all entrepreneurs should consider writing a book why is that a book is the most powerful marketing tool in the world it's a way for you to share your story and your company's story without anyone ever feeling like they are being sold to it builds Authority it builds credibility it builds expertise for you and your business ad we're recording this in the middle of this unprecedented crisis is now a good time to write a book uh Believe It or Not Lauren I would argue now is a better time probably than ever before entrepreneurs and business owners have an unprecedented amount of time on their calendar that quite frankly they did not think that they would have we are working with entrepreneurs all over the world who are using this unexpected downtime to create an asset for their business that will pay dividends for the rest of their career if someone does write a book how will they know if it's effective as a marketing tool they use a book as a sleuth marketing tool to generate new customers uh to advertise their business and ultimately to help convert uh prospects into customers and for many entrepreneurs a customer can be worth hundreds thousands even tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars and so one new customer into your business can more than pay for the book uh speaking off opportunities PR and media opportunities those are some of the other benefits I know a lot of entrepreneurs who've wanted to write a book and have never quite gotten around to it how do you help somebody in that situation we do our best to make it as easy and painless as possible and we do that by first pairing you with a master book planner who spends some time interviewing you and those interviews turn into a blueprint for your book then we assign a ghost writer to work with you to ask you questions about that Master book plan to interview you it's all done over the phone Lauren so it's super easy those interviews are then ultimately turned by The Ghost Writer into the manuscript of your book if someone wants to learn more where should they go we have a free copy of my best selling book titled book the business and we're offering a discovery consultation to any 21 hat subscriber that wants to learn more Advantage family.com sl21 hats you heard him go to it Advantage family.com sl21 hats to get Adam's book and to sign up for your consultation now back to the [Music] show as usual let's start with uh quick updates Dana uh what's the status of paral Boyd what's going on with you per Boyd has received her the PPP whoa yeah I know yeah kind of major um it was not through my bank it was through uh Goldman Sachs interesting um yep you got it through Goldman Sachs because you participated in the Goldman Sachs 10,000 small businesses yep so they sent an email out to us a couple of weeks ago saying Hey listen you guys we actually have partnered with someone who can move this along you know quite well so the difference with the Goldman Sachs money is they looked at all of 2019 whereas in my bank and another entity they looked at from April 2019 to April 2020 so the Goldman Sachs money is like less by like $6,000 and so I also applied through blue Vine and my application was accepted through blue Vine as well wait wait wait I'm not familiar with that glue Vine what is that so blue Vine is a lender similar to lendo girlfriend of mine said Dana blue Vine is like approving and getting PPP funds out right away and their application process was very simple um their responsiveness was amazing um and so I went ahead and applied through them too I was torn about applying through multiple places but I was just looking at the level of contact from my bank why were you torn because people were like you know you you should apply once and wait well my bank kept saying you know we need you to sign the document we need you to sign the document so I would fill out the document sign it per as per their instructions and then I get another email you need to sign the document and I said I can't keep signing this document and my just application just wasn't moving so I took the reins in my own hands and applied through the Goldman Sachs program I also applied through blue Vine anybody else nope just those three um blue Vine has said you've been approved we're just waiting on your loan number and Goldman Sachs has a loan number and an amount so and what happened with PNC have they gotten back to you I wish we could put a Cricut sound effect right here cricket cricket I've said this before I need to say again the big Banks just don't need little accounts period they well Chase just sent out an email to tons of small businesses that I know today that they all got their money well three weeks two weeks later a week later saying I yeah they sent it out 3:00 am this morning and then just on my Goldman Sachs web feed on my news feed on Facebook everybody's like oh I got awarded I got awarded I got awarded so but the anxiety and the nerve that everybody was going through not knowing what to do right should I apply or whatever so one thing I I would add all the advice I've heard is there's nothing wrong in fact there's a lot good about applying in multiple places the only thing you can't do is you can't take the loan more than one loan um that that would be a problem uh but you definitely did the right thing by uh applying in multiple places I hadn't heard that I had I had heard apply one place and sit tight even the Goldman Sachs Lo said do not apply if you've applied already and I ignored it as did several other people good for in our Goldman Sachs class and they were approved within 24 hours it was the Goldman Sachs people that actually picked up the phone and called me and asked questions so the entrepreneur lesson from this is you can't always follow the rules and that is the reality you were you were doing the right thing listening to all the quote unquote professionals you were doing what you were supposed to do with your big bank and they didn't come through for you so you took you used the phrase you took it into your own hands and you got the job done I think the other lesson that I'm hearing is join these apply and try to become part of these programs you know the ernston young program the Goldman Sachs program you know if there's a local program because that becomes your quote unquote networking um and that's their goal that's what I'm hearing yeah those organizations are invaluable like I wouldn't have had it had I not been in alum and the other thing is you know when it comes to entrepreneurship don't ask when you're asking you're waiting right because you're waiting on somebody to decide to help you or not I chose not to ask PNC and wait for PNC to decide that they were going to get to my application well you know the phrase better to beg for forgiveness than ask for permission that's another example of it so do you know Dana is there any reason to think the loans will be different and that you have a material choice to make here or do you think it's it doesn't really matter which one you pick I think it matters in just the amount of funding like I said with the Goldman Sachs loan they did January of 19 to January 2020 so that means it's going to be you know it's up like $339,000 loan whereas the blue Vine loan is April to April which is going to be a bigger loan so I may go with the blue Vine um and I don't know if this is legal or not but the governor of Michigan just extended the stay-at-home order to May 28th so if I get closing docks next week Dana may not be signing closing docks next week I know a lot of small business owners that I'm talking to are rescheduling their closings so you're saying you might not take the loan I may not I'll take it I just may not schedule my closing no she's Del laying it because she's going to be closed which is smart better to add a week at the back end when you're open than get it now when you're closed again smart you have to spend it within eight weeks so if I went to get my closing documents let's say you know Monday the 4th then they they're processed and the B Money hits my account mon you know Tuesday the 5th well then the clock starts starting Tuesday I have eight weeks from Tuesday the 5th to to use it well I'm saying no when is you know hey let's schedule that closing for as far out as I can go and then go from there do you have any reason to believe that they'll accommodate you will will they let you wait as long as you want to wait I mean they don't don't I mean scheduling a closing it's it's it's your schedule if I'm unavailable nobody's unavailable like no but if I'm I could be caring for a sick loved one I could be I could be walking my dog have you thought about how you're going to start spending it and when you're going to start spending it and you close on the loan but your shop is still closed are you going to pay people before your shop reopens probably two people to get us reopened right and so I've already done the setup work so that when I do bring them back I can just give them their marching orders and pay them not to help me get set up but here are your marching orders and go and pay them um and then when she does give the green light to open I will pay my put all my staff based on who we have put all my staff back on um and then if there's anybody who has any questions you know I'm not feeling comfortable okay then I have to let you go because I'm not in Michigan they are very clear you will go to jail if you have a job and you tell somebody no you can stay at home and stay on unemployment no I'm not doing that and then they come back and then we'll have a training we'll have some cultural engagement some you know rahr meetings I'll give everybody their their face mask to you know train them on how we're going to keep ourselves safe how we're going to be different again do more training to get their skills honed and then we will have an opening date and then we will open on that date B but it may not be the day that she says we can open I'm not opening up gang busters no I'm not doing that Jay you uh have told us previously that you got uh a PPP loan uh you're in a similar position and that your business has been closed but but yours your your state is handling it differently you're uh in in Illinois you're able to start opening I believe today is that correct no no no no no it was pushed till the end of the month but I sell plants in my home store I have a whole big lot next to my store that in the summer we sell plants I mean like you know like 3 4,000 feet we have a big lot out there so because I sell plants I'm called a plant store and I service some landscapers therefore I am allowed to open that store wait the whole store or just the lot with the plants you know you go to Home Depot because they sell some Building Supplies they're open no stores are part open so if you sell something that somebody needs the whole store is open so I I am confident it's okay for us to carefully open the store and control how many people are in there and masks and the whole thing so do you do you have predictions on or projections on how busy it's going to be I mean I went you know drove by Lowe's like the parking lot is completely full constantly well that's funny you ask because I'm an hour behind you know Lauren it's 11:25 here I've been open for an hour and 25 minutes and before we're done here I will find out whether anyone should showed up or not but from what I heard we were getting lots of emails that people were anxious to to for us to reopen so so there I'm good my wholesale business selling frames I sell frames to a thousand frame shops around the country I believe that falls under the category of distribution and quote unquote managing my inventory now most of the stores are still closed so I'm not doing anything there yet in my retail picture frame store uh there's no way I can open that there's no there's just there's no wiggle room there whatsoever so my framing business is closed my home store was open for for all of an hour and a half now and you open to today the whole the whole store today and not just the plants an hour and a half ago and I don't know frankly I didn't go outside yet to see if I I'm gonna I'll I'll leave this thing for 60 seconds and tell you whether there's any business here so we we made up signage we made a very clear everybody's wearing masks customers employees are wearing masks we're putting tables in front of the check out so they can't get too close we're we're cleaning the place we're watching how many people are in there and then there was one other directive I gave to everybody which is we're suspending the cardinal rule of this company for 42 years the customer is not always right we will if they all know when they start here don't go fighting with customers we will fight with a customer they want to come in and be a jerk and say I'm not wearing a mask we're going to tell them they got to leave and like that's the way it is I'm not I'm not going to get intimidated by a a customer who thinks it's okay to come in without a mask um they and and that's a huge that's a huge change for my employees and I wanted to make sure they know I'll back you up um they're not going to come in here and throw their weight around go I'm not wearing a mask this is overreacted that's fine go somewhere else um I got no use for that are you limiting the number of people who can come in at any one time yes we're starting with eight you know the store is about seven 8,000 feet we think that we're going to start with eight people but my you come up with that number I you know the size of the store and we figured out what we could handle we're only keeping one door open instead of two I got to tell you my employees are not thrilled to be at work um they would have just soon stayed home is that because they're concerned about their safety or because they were collecting the uh unemployment with the extra $600 a week that falls under the category of who knows I do think though that they sincerely are worried about it and all we can do is everybody's wearing masks staying away but like I just can't I don't have the luxury of just saying I'll tell you what um well maybe we'll open six weeks eight weeks I mean there's some point where I'll be out of business I I you know and it whatever the day is that that any but business opens in this country there is still going to be some risk out there so it's a question of you know one a time to jump in and we're being extremely careful with how we do it and extremely respectful to the employees that you know they don't have to to to get near the customers but I I I are you paying them Hazard pay I'm thinking about it I haven't done anything yet because unlike Michigan apparently that made it Crystal Clear people about the unemployment I'm still grappling with should the people that are home should we put everyone back on the payroll and bring them back or leave on unemployment the whole thing is just a big murky mess and you know I'm trying to do the right thing quote unquote but it's not clear what the right thing is and we're trying to be and then the question is going to become this is just this is just scene two of a 10 scene play the next question is and what about the employee who doesn't want to come back in two weeks three weeks where do you finally say sorry but I've got to replace your job and then are they going to be eligible for unemployment if you've offered them the job back and they didn't come you know I don't know and they're not well no you're in Michigan maybe in Michigan I gotta tell you you who knows who knows uh I'm not sure which way it's going how comfortably are you with the idea of of opening your store now I mean most medical experts that they would prefer that you know we're not opening back up the way we are customers are wearing mask we're wearing mask we're putting t no one's going to get anywhere near six feet we're cleaning everything I would say this all of the experts get a paycheck every single Friday I'll guarantee you but Jay it's not as simple as that there's a point in time where it's it's just I'm not going to do anything that's perilous anybody but I think were being extremely careful are you worried about potential liability suppose one of your employees gets sick um this is becoming a regular theme with the show if I was to worry about everything that I could worry about I would be in a mental institution somewhere so I'm not going to say worry it's like we're taking all the precautions we can take and um I think it'll be okay if I didn't think it would be okay I wouldn't be doing it so is it possible that someone's going to get sick and then blame it on that they came into work I'm following the law I'm doing everything I'm supposed to be doing um it's it's a difficult situation I is anybody doing waivers like liability release when you come in the store like the government is trying to if you if you've been the government's trying to make it illegal to sue a company if somebody gets sick they can sue their employer there there won't be any companies left well you didn't ask this question which is a good fair question Jay has anybody been s no I don't have one sick employee that I know of so you know I'm I think we've been quarantined nicely I I think we're being prudent I think we're being careful I had plants ordered for six months these plants are showing up here I've got you know a lot of money invested in Plants I've got customers who are clamoring to come in to get their plants I'm garding is huge if youve read any other retail numbers like it's just going roof right so there's people that want this stuff they're being careful we're being careful I mean at what point do I just I mean I think you're doing a great job I mean thank you yeah well people I've been in your shop that's it's reasonable it's not overboard I mean it's not going to look like Walmart looks no you know it's not g to look I mean again I go by Lowe's and it is UN I've never seen the parking lot so full it's more full than it's ever been so to have you know a private store that already has an kind of a niche audience be open with eight people at a time I just don't see an issue with it I mean people are running business we're running a business and we have more than eight people at our location so and they're humans so what's the difference between and they're there by choice okay so let let me see if I can annoy all three of you you already have Lauren done I know I got you Jay the the the big picture here though is I think this by opening back up now when the experts are saying it's too soon they're saying we are running the risk of triggering a second wave and I think the worst thing for all of us for the country and for your businesses too would be for us to have wasted this time that we spent shut down and and to have to do it again and that's what I really worry about do do you not worry about that Jay you left a piece of the puzzle out some of these people I saw in the paper this morning in the w Journal Michigan a bunch of people showed up at the capital with guns saying we want to be open and they don't have masks on what is the piece I left out I'm talking about customers all have masks we have masks they're not getting anywhere near each other more than six feet part we're following all of these things to keep everyone away from each other it's not like I'm I'm minimizing the problem and going oh it's been overblown we don't need to wear mask we're not letting anybody in without a mask we're going to send them away so I think if you take all these precautions I I believe it will be okay um I'm not one of these people that are you see these people with their protests they're out there in crowd with no mess I think that's crazy so that's not what we're doing you know we're taking all the precautions I agree I think calling every day yeah you're being responsible people are far apart it's not you're not opening a movie theater no well I don't know I'm getting ready for the second wave I'm here in Michigan I'm looking at people I'm getting ready for the second wave that's what I'm doing and you're saying that because you see people who are not being responsible absolutely and and we don't have enough tests if you're watching what's happening in in in the Homeland in in Iowa Nebraska and the people have not been hit hard enough yet not enough people for them have died for them to take this seriously enough to shut it down so okay you guys go ahead and play with this I am not I'm getting ready for fall 2020 when we will most likely have to shut down again because Cletus and Bubba and jeffro and them want to go and and and hang out in the backyard you know because the governor said I can't I can't I can't hang out with my friends they're mad so you be mad and be sick while Dana is getting ready to have a much more distance online interaction with her customers getting ready for what's going to happen in the fall and maybe since I'm not opening till May 28th that might be something I can do you know in the time it takes time to put products and kits together but I'm getting ready for the second wave right now and then if we can open that'll be great we'll you know open generate Revenue use PPP have some cushion but when and if we have to shut down again I will be ready that's what I'm getting ready I'm not in a vacuum Like Home Depot's open there's hundreds of people there Low's is open everybody doing business I should decide oh no I'm going to take it to a newer level and I'm not I'm going to let tens of thousands of dollars of plants die and I'm just going to shut it down because um and then the customers I'm not the customers are calling us they want to come in and buy their stuff there is a point to where the customers want to come in we want to sell them things we're all protecting we're all wearing all this right stuff there is a point to where you got to make a value judgment and um I don't know that I can go another month without doing any business I mean I really wait wait wa wait why do you say that Jay because I have been shut down it will be 10 weeks of next to no business coming to in I don't have I don't have $3 million sitting in a bank account somewhere I've had no business coming in you did get a PPP loan does that make a difference that's PA the people with it I use it for payroll doesn't change the fact that that well you can 25% of it you can use for for other including rent right utilities and rent yeah that'll get yeah except except this isn't going to be a light switch going back on we're gonna I am sure I'm gonna lose a ton of money this year so as soon as we're the lift is over it's not like business back to usual I mean I've still got the same overheads I still got the employees it wouldn't be surprising if my business is off by 30 40% the day we open Jay I have a question can you do pick up for Framing and delivery framing can you do um delivery of furniture um yes we already have a web Json home.com with a Y Json home we we we we we absolutely St stuff on the internet and people can pick out furniture and we can deliver it framing we're hanging plastic Shields over the sales counters and people are protected there if they want to dis digitally send in photographs we can certainly frame those wait you you told us that you haven't opened the frame store I can't I mean that isn't an option at this point when you said you're hanging uh plastic that's what you're talking about PL that's your plan that's what you're going to do when you can open we're going to do it for sure when we open again and then on top of which I am putting in some software where you can frame online and come pick it up I don't think that my customers mostly are going to decide after all these years that they're going to want to start framing pictures online I don't I believe that most people are going to get back to quote unquote some kind of normal and I think that um I do I don't think that that the world's going to stop doing picture framing that's what I'm counting on it and and just so you have some perspective I'm dealing with a very small niche market people who are into their Interiors people that want to frame their FR their own photographs are most people have never been into a frame shop and never will so I'm dealing with a very small Niche with that being said they're into it because they realize the secret to a happy life is having beautiful picture framing and they know that so they're not and I thought it was meditation and enlightment that's it's a little known fact that it's picture framing first and then meditation and then God I've been way off track yeah well that's why I'm here I'm here to help Jay could you open the the the frame shop on by appointment only technically yeah no I mean could I get away with it um and lock the door and probably but then I got the problem with now I got to bring people into production to go do the framing and and believe me I thought about it but like I don't know that it's worth all the trouble because unlike a restaurant you know you lose the meal in the restaurant it's gone here's a case of if they have a picture to frame they'll wait for me to open so there'll be some pent up demand I don't know that it's going to be worth all of the trouble to try to do that but I'm wondering with the amount of time that people are spending at home there may need to do things around the house like picture framing weting a new roof on right so there are things that we're now around the house because we're here all the time and I think that's a marketing push if you want to invest the dollars and saying are you tired of looking at that old da have it framed at here's the problem though the problem is the question is how many of my customers have been financially affected by this whether psychologically because their stock portfolio is down or because they were laid off I don't know I mean that's the problem for I think you're niche market you are a niche market right you're not a hamburger right you're a Costco you're not a Sams no offense to those to those two big major businesses I think your niche market is spending money Lowe's is jammed for a reason people are at home getting paid and I think I think if you Market it to people who are you know working from home still making their salary um because business is still coming in I think you know hey you know this wall doesn't have to be drab anymore and this is how we can help you make your home beautiful while you're in it why don't you just mark it to Karen's all of Karen's employees Mark Karen's employees right and I'm wondering if you could expand your market right I see you shipping across the country I know there are women that are cross stitching right now there's a company that that went into doing online framing they've gone through $90 million and still don't make any money and custom picture framing is still one of those things that you're better off doing it in person to see the texture to see the stuff and then on top which shipping glass is not a great thing and then if you've got any artwork that's of any value and the art is hinged properly meaning it's suspended in the frame by definition it can't be shipped upside down it'll break the hinges so it's just it's the worst possible thing to try to ship it flat and the UPS charges get more because it's flat and it's bigger what I've learned about business is I can't say six steps ahead I'm taking one step at a time and we'll see what comes because I I you know I see people on the news now with their predictions of this is going to be the this is going to be a depression with the World War II and it's like shut up I mean you just don't know anything I mean you don't know that and and they're making predictions there's absolutely no way of J you've been saying that week after week here and and it's gotten pretty bad you've noticed that right it is bad it's horrible how about CNN saying unemployment numbers there's people have lost their jobs um we have the same jobless as the depression okay did they remember the fact that people can't go to work right now and that as soon as their businesses are open up they're going back to work to use to use the unemployment number and to say they lost their jobs they didn't lose their jobs they were fured for a month or two but they never make that distinction Jay they they're they don't have their jobs they've been fured they didn't lose their job they were fur no guarantee that those jobs will be there for them two months from now for most of them it will maybe you don't know that make a parallel between this point in time all right let's not argue economics I I I want to I I can find another way to annoy you again you're very good at it you're actually gifted thank you I appreciate that I want to go back to what you said uh about the concerns among your employees and and I think it's an important point and let me stress here uh you know you you've been kind enough to share your journey on this pod podcast and and I do appreciate that and I'm asking you these questions cuz you're here a representative of you know all three of you are representative of people who are trying to make the best of a really awful situation so I want to stress that I you know when I ask about the the you know what the experts are saying and the risks it's not because I think that whether or not there's a second wave hinges upon whether Jason home is open or not but it's you you know it's you're representative of a lot of business businesses that have to make really difficult decisions and and I want to try to think those through part of it involves your employees you mentioned that your uh employees aren't terribly happy about this and I think that brings up an important point because you can be incredibly responsible in the store and I'm sure you are um but your employees have to get there and some may be taking public transportation some may be pumping gas there are things they have to do that increases the risk and it you know it changes the the risk factor for all of us so I'm asking how are you dealing with the concerns among your employees if somebody said I don't want to take the L blah blah blah I would get someone to pick them up my HR person is calling every single employee to make sure they're okay and it turns out one guy who didn't speak great English did not file for unemployment soon enough he literally he put his wife on the phone because his English wasn't great and he he's been with me for four years and she said we have no money we need medication for our kid I went over there and gave some cash to get them through it they'll get they'll eventually get unemployment so we are doing what we can and and for the employees I wouldn't tell someone to go take the L at this point if that's a problem um it's just not black and white what about somebody who has who's been caring for for somebody or has or or has kids at home who can't go to school yeah they should stay home I mean what am I going to do they should stay home but did does that create a problem in terms of unemployment if they're um if you ask them to come back I'm going to guess not um not my call it's unemployment's call I'm I I'm going to guess not but I you know I'm not going to tell everybody lock your kids in the closet come to work I need you here I mean um though some of them would be happy to do that at this point I can assure you um I have one person who comes to work every day she's got an Annie at home and she doesn't want to be at home and she hasn't missed a day and she's happy to be at work I mean there are people that want to go to work every day um will there be some collateral damage on this at the end is there somebody that's going to um maybe I mean maybe there is going to come a point where where people need to go back to work and we're going to have to say to them it's not going to be this month probably it'll probably be after the whole stay is lifted and things are supposed to be getting back tomorrow at some point we would have to tell the person listen we need someone to take care of the customers when they come in and if you don't want to come in we're going to have to replace your job I mean what am I going to do wait what if they say I really like to wait till the end of the year when winter comes and it I mean there's some point where you got to take care of business and and believe me these people that are out there protesting I'm not supporting that at all but there is a line somewhere you will never be risk-free in this situation it's not not for a year or two there is going to be a point that some people are still going to have it and somebody's going to have to say okay it's safe enough you know I live in a city of 250,000 people and you walk around and you would almost never even know that this is happening you know I mean we've had I don't know 100 cases in the whole County 200 cases in the whole County I think we've all had different experiences based on either a geography or what kind of business we're in um and I I just don't think the rules are going to apply the same to everybody no I can tell you if you walk out front here people jogging walking the door most people have mask on it's it's all over the place I went to Home Depot uh a week ago and people were some of the employees in a mask and I hit a mask on walked up to to one of the people I go is there a store manager yeah Al is he here no he's off today I go why aren't you wearing a mask well I had it on before I go you should have it on all the time I went in there this morning there wasn't a person in the store without a mask so it's and they did make it a liw as of today so I go to the grocery store I'm one of three people in the grocery store never even cross somebody in the aisle I see one person the whole time there's plexiglass in between me and the lady that checks us out so I'm all I'm saying is that and we all know this and we've heard this but based on where we live and the population density and probably other factors um we're having completely different experiences very very different experiences so Lauren when it comes to can you open business is that the responsible thing to do blah blah blah yes o or overall no it is not the right thing to do but I think that in some cases you know if we use good judgment that it's not necessarily A Bad Thing I want to follow up on that but Jay this is uh would be a good time for you to go find out uh what your uh traffic has been like okay you talk about me while I'm gone I'll gone for 40 seconds I'll listen to the recording later hold on Laura let me ask you um you shut down your brick and mortar store I believe um what what where do things stand with that is there any Prospect of it reopening no no we don't have any plans to reopen it not for quite a while is is that because the restrictions remain in place or because you don't feel the need to reopen it um I think a little bit of both uh part of it is even is our customer base is an elder I mean not elderly um but you know some of our customer base is a high-risk base so I don't feel like it's necessarily the I don't feel any urgency um given that we have other sources of income um and that's not the primary part of our business it's not the primary driver and you've been selling well online you've told us uh after we that that's still true yeah the retail store has always been 5% or less of our business so um yeah no I don't feel any urgency um and even you know our store manager is an older man uh in his 60s and he's taken off you know and he's on unemployment right now and just decided he left a long time ago he's like it's not worth it it's not worth the risk so once we hit the 14 days or maybe 21 days of of no more cases in town um will consider it but I'm not in a rush the company you bought in Texas is a wholesaler that sells to uh retail yarn shops around the country and you've told us that that's struggled for obvious reasons throughout this is there any indication that some of those stores uh are starting to open uh how's that looking it's consistent so we're losing money every day um you know I told you we're paying people even if they're not coming to work uh because we don't have enough work for them um but at least we're losing money consistently so we're able to kind of predict it and we don't see that changing significantly for probably three months we're also um you know our suppliers we have a mill in Peru and a mill in South Africa I mean they've been shut down and they're going to be and they're the primary suppliers of yarn of wool in the world um and so even the other yarn suppliers in the country none of us can get our yarn so we're all going to kind of run out a product here in just a little bit how soon um we're thinking we have about six weeks of Supply left um at the current demand given that our demand is about half of what it normally would be is there anything you can do what do you have a plan yes we have some some older inventory that has been sitting around that we inherited um or I guess we purchased so we'll just get creative with old inventory we're going to get creative we have a lot of kind of mistakes some second quality or some items that people had cancelled so stuff that's in the returns pile how big an industry is the iron business you know at one point it was about it was like 1.1 billion that's interesting because framing is about two and a half so then I would argue probably only 1% of the population is knitting stuff that's it couldn't be much more to only do a billion dollars in the United States so you're also dealing with a tiny little niche oh it's tiny yeah very very tiny okay so I'm back 10 customers okay which you know not bad how much did they spend I don't know I didn't spend there long enough to find out 10 customers just for plants yeah there's not that many PL I just I gotta tell you I got here at 8 this morning there wasn't a plant in the lot so I was the truck just came it's probably only a quarter filled we're waiting for more shipments to come in throughout to day and then through Monday so and it's not that hot out it's like you know it when the temperature goes up people like all of a sudden like you know get activated and go out to plant their Gardens right now it's probably in the 50s so it's still a little chilly but I think tomorrow I'm expecting I would think by tomorrow we'll probably be doing okay out there um I'm curious and I know this is a tangent but why would somebody buy a plant from you as opposed to Home Depot or Lowe's um because um you know I got into the business like by accident I'm not I'm not in anything close I I have no idea about that stuff I'm a picture frame guy but the building came up for sale and I was trying to tie up the real estate for something and I I wasn't ready to move framing so I as a placeholder I opened a garden store and what we learned over the first couple years we're in an upscale Urban environment we're not Home Depot they don't come in with dirty blue jeans and a laundry list of what they want they want cool interesting stuff so just like in my frame business just like in the home store it's a boutique thing we plants we can we don't have everything I can't even give you the names I don't know it we don't carry it we carry whatever the best in the market is at the moment and people appreciate that and they come here because Home Depot's literally one mile away if not maybe even less so Laura H H how much is Jay paying you to ask questions like that oh no I think it's a really good I mean it's a good one for us to think about is like why would you go there what what differentiates it's the same thing yarn industry like why would you come to Jimmy beans and buy yarn when you could go to Joann's or Michaels you know there's a quality thing there's a service Laura he doesn't understand the higher level stuff like this yes Hees that was a smart question believe me I asked myself that and the other thing is Home Depot they buy stuff from vendors they don't actually pay for it till it gets bought by the customer so the stuff's not taken care of that well we have people that are paying more attention to the plants and um they you know they want better you play them music at night do you play music yeah it's a whole it's a whole lifestyle business thing yeah okay great I just want to make sure those plants are taken care of you're nurtured everything we do is nurtured a all right before I offend all three of you it's too late for that one we're gonna have to wrap this up um thank you all for doing this uh I appreciate again as always the fact that you're willing to come here and be so transparent about what you're going through I think it means a lot to a lot of people I would just say to people who don't own businesses it's really easy to sit back and take shots at business owners like oh I would never open you know what have you ever had to pay the rent on Friday I don't think so I mean it's it's it is a little frustrating to see the politicians who have never run a lemonade stand deciding the Way businesses should be running what I'm learning through this whole process is you you have to do what you have to do I know I've I've applied for over 14 grants two loans I got my eidl today which is wonderful I've got the PPP wait whoa whoa whoa whoa we buried the lead I should have asked you about that at the beginning I don't know anybody who's gotten an eidl me neither so I got I don't even know what that is yeah so it's the emergency disaster loan it's the sba's disaster loan and it's been all messed up that's why I'm getting ready for the second wave and using grant money to keep the lights on keep the phones on keep the internet going getting ready for when we hit go ordering new capes because when we get the new capes it's a matter of that Cape is done for the day no more disinfecting it and using it again in this climate since you know the people my market is being disproportionately affected African-Americans are being disproportionately affected so since that's majority of my business I have to do what I have to do as a business owner to keep the guest of Perle boy safe so no you know tiles are always thrown out but tripling up on towels tripling up on CES and just getting ready to go and using the money that I be fortunate enough to get through grants and eidl and PPP to hold the ship together for those that have listened to this podcast from the beginning you've gotten to watch how Dana has gone from a warrior to a warrior you have your own Superwoman cape and I couldn't be prder and happier to be associated with you because you are entrepreneur of the Year thank you on that note my thanks to Jay goz Dana White and Laura Xander really appreciate it guys be careful out there thanks for listening everybody this episode was produced by Jess thubron founder of blank word Productions remember we started the 21 hats podcast to to help business owners feel a little less isolated to let them know they aren't the only ones fighting these battles if you got something out of this conversation please help us reach more people tell a friend subscribe and review us wherever you get your podcasts follow us on Twitter at21 hats and let me know if you have a question or a comment or a topic you'd like us to cover my email address is L Feldman at21 hats.com see you next time [Music]