Reshaping the Post-Pandemic Workplace: Employee Owned Businesses, Part 5 with EOT Employee Panel

welcome everybody to the enlightened entrepreneur podcast and thank you for joining us here to build livelihoods that matter be your own boss and make the world an even better place i'm your host julie sampson director of the sheinfeld center and let's get to it well we know that 2022 is dubbed the year of the worker with a great resignation and reshuffle in response to the pandemic the question is how can businesses leverage this opportunity to redesign the workplace for greater equity and a more rewarding and engaging experience for workers in this final episode of our five podcast series we finish up our exploration of the transformative impact of employee-owned businesses especially as it relates to employee-owned trust do employees experience a difference in the culture rewards and responsibilities within an eot business and does the ownership structure meet the current needs that employees nationwide are asking for providing some perspective on all of this are three employees from eot businesses joining us from montecito california is nicole elias she is soon to be vice president at montecito estate management a boutique estate management company when their transformation to eot is complete from ontario new york is john farley who is group leader in the optical coding department at optimax a high precision optics manufacturer that formed their eot in 2020 and from portland oregon john forsythe is a loan processor at equity atlas a mortgage company that's transforming how home financing is managed and they form their eot in 2017. we're grateful for all three of you joining us here today thank you so much thank you thank you okay so before we jump in let's give our audience a quick definition of employee ownership so we could say that employee ownership is where a company's employees are full or part-time owners of the business and there are different types of employee ownership one type is the employee ownership trust also called eot for short and it's a trust that holds some or all of the shares of a company for the purpose of providing financial benefit and governance rights to the employees of the company and if you'd like to take a deeper dive on that this is the fifth podcast in this series the other videos are linked below in the video description and check those out to get up to speed but back to our panelists let's start right now right off the top with how long you've worked at your current eot company and whether you experience any differences working for this eot company versus other work experiences that you've had so nicole could you start us off with that you're kind of in the unique position of currently going through the transition to eot yeah we are um we're just about rounding it out it's a longer process about 11 to 12 months so we're on the tail end and um so far with our transition it it has been vastly different um i can't speak to how it will be afterwards and um longer term in the future but even just now i mean the responsibilities and um kind of what you hold within the company is is very different and it feels different um it matters more all of your efforts contribute to something bigger so it feels good and it's definitely a different approach to working and i'm grateful that we're doing this and have the opportunity to be so invested so it's felt good yeah awesome and how long have you been with montecito estate management i've been here for about two years okay great oh wow that's uh that's some nice upward mobility yeah that's great well congratulations uh so john forsyth what's your take um i mean i i i mean it was all brand new to me i came on board with equity atlas maybe about 10 months ago and i've known about employee ownership there's not a whole lot of it going on in georgia where i'm from i moved to portland oregon a couple years ago i know they tend to think more progressive out here in the west so that's partially why i came out here and sort of got lucky finding equity atlas i was just looking for a job and i came to a i'm a hiring company a temp agency a non-profit and i somehow landed my job at equity atlas not knowing what an eot was and not really knowing um the benefits it just seemed like a good job that i had the skills for which is really just some math and some computer skills it's not anything crazy but learning about the eot and employee ownership i mean i have a competitive pay rate which is great um the work i do is not monotonous it's yes i process loans but because it's employee owned i'm also doing whatever sort of needs to be done and i'm and i'm not i don't feel exploited though that's the biggest thing it's just stuff that needs to be done so the company can move forward so operations go and i'm happy to do it because you're just you're treated differently you're not just a number or like a means to an end the sole purpose of equity atlas is to create good jobs and take wealth back that's being exploited from the traditional banks and the regular mortgage industry a lot of it is centralized in a lot of banking institutions that just forward the profits and gouge people out of their money so the whole purpose of equity atlas is to redistribute the wealth and i highly value those aspects about it that's amazing thank you for that business it can be such a force for good and it's just so awesome to see that happening yeah and uh john farley how about you yeah so i've been at optimax for just about four years now um and i came from a company uh where i used to live that was uh the opposite of this so we when i started at that company it was a very it was a privately owned company and within a year they sold out to a multinational corporation um and then when that company came in uh that started with layoffs and everybody kind of walking on eggshells and kind of you know just kind of that hanging over your head all the time so when i was looking to change jobs and i moved from massachusetts uh here at upstate new york um one of the things i was looking for was a privately owned company something with uh stability that really valued their employees and that's what optimax brings to the table and with us transitioning to the eot uh at the end of 2020 uh as rick and mike are starting to transition uh towards their retirement they wanted to make sure that this company stayed for the employees and the same thing that happened to me at my last job did not happen here so that's certainly been a highly motivating factor and you can see the difference night and day between the best job versus the employees and the hard work that we put in here everybody really cares about their job here versus uh kind of like uh john said you know where you're just a number on a spreadsheet at the last job and just kind of waiting to see when the accident was going to fall so yeah yeah um it it's really interesting because there is this uh silver tsunami going on where uh a lot of the you know boomer generation who have had businesses are going into succession you know and and what you talked about in terms of like uh an acquisition happening or something like that it can be so hard on the employee the employees and and create the culture like you were describing that um it's just kind of sad sad to see right and so it's really uplifting to hear about um your experience with the eot and kind of what that's generate generating were are there any requirements that you needed to meet before like you could really become an employee owner in the eot or did it start right from the get-go uh john forsythe would you like to lead us off sure um as far as equity at ls there wasn't i mean i described the the small bit of skills i needed which is some computer and some math skills but otherwise the equity atlas the the way it's governed or constructed is so that i mean the eot allows you to just sort of hop in the shares are issued with as new employees come on board so um it's not like i had to go jump through some hoops to be granted employee ownership it's sort of built in the framework and i'm still not exactly sure how it functions i'm not technically in the nitty-gritty about how the framework works but i know uh you interviewed one of the founders of equity atlas brad hiffert and he has told me numerous times how they they just took a fine-tooth comb trying to hammer out this eot framework um from you know importing it over from the ppt the professional trust um so it's no i didn't really uh have any have to do anything special to become an employee owner and john farley how about you yeah same so uh with the eot that we have here the the elt is really the meet and there's sort of three main tenants to the eot here is that number one is to not sell the business uh it's to remain you know within as we are now uh number two is to share profits with the employees uh optimax has a great program where we share 25 of the profits every month go back to the employees in the form of a bonus check which is obviously a good motivator to keep working and keep working hard and then the third tenant is to continue to grow the business both technologically and to continue to grow the employees and help everybody prosper that way so in that sense um for me uh you know not technically being an employee owner but being under under the trust uh the only real qualification for that uh with the profit sharing program is that once you're here for three months you're technically eligible to start accumulating and why don't you hit five years then you're fully invested in that in that program but other than that yeah that's about that's about it amazing opportunity and how about you nicole we're still in the process of um working through the details but it's my understanding that there will be some eligibility requirements so we'll kind of finalize what those will be and utilize them moving forward it seems something that's nice about the eot is that uh businesses can kind of tune it to you know their individual needs and uh you know vision for the company and all that there there's the basic foundation the premise about what it what it is but um it's nice that there is that flexibility like equity atlas start it off as an eot right from the get go uh optimax came along down the road and uh montecito estate management the same thing so um that's interesting to hear about your different experiences so can you talk about the responsibility that you carry as an eot owner like you know i think it becomes more clear with the company however the company is performing it's going to affect you know your experience of the benefits of the eot so are there any like what is the top responsibility that you feel like you need to take on to really make the the form of employee ownership at your company um uh work john farley would you like to start us off sure yeah i'd say uh you know the top responsibility i really really here is just to show up and do your job and do your job well uh your hard work goes a long way here you know we've got a lot of opportunities training programs and automatics really invest in their workforce as far as building you up and giving you any kind of training or learning that you need to do so i think really in my eyes the number one thing you can do is just show up work hard do your job well and this guy's kind of limit from there i think there's probably a lot of things i could list for that i would say leadership and commitment and communication feel like those would be my top three um i mean that's so hard because there are a lot of things that go into it but um just like john said showing up and being there and doing your job so having a commitment to others um you know also committing to communicating and just really taking the leadership role seriously and understanding that there is an effect for everyone else in turn of that so those would be my top three so let's talk more specifically about the benefits that you get to experience we've you know it's come up a bit here but uh you know for our our audience who is learning about neot and might be thinking oh you know that might be something i'm interested in you know working for an eot could you speak more to specifically what you experience as the benefits to to it in your own personal life and maybe professional growth too um i would say a benefit would be investment so you feel like that you're being invested in as much as you invest in your work and your job in the company so oftentimes i think a lot of people share this within the great resignation as you work really hard and you feel like there's no turn in that you don't see anything for it you don't feel appreciated valued and i think as humans we strive to feel appreciated and valued in anything we do especially our work if we really invest in it so um just you know being being invested and then seeing that in turn is really rewarding it feels good and it just it makes you want to do more and that's important i think for a company and a business to grow and have a healthier work-life balance and just feel good about being there and what you're doing for others and they're grateful as well uh john forsyth how about you um i mean i mentioned uh my competitive pay rate earlier um we also do uh quarterly profit sharing um i mean that's all good i'm and stuff i'm not really used to in working traditional jobs in the past and um as far as responsibilities and you know i i actually have taken on the role of updating our uh profit and loss you know sensitive information that i normally wouldn't have be touching in some regular jobs so um if i don't do the p l then we can't really profit share so uh it's it's me taking on a role that is uh you know i'm forced to summon some responsibility and take ownership and uh um yeah as far as benefits and responsibilities that's that's what what i do at activity atlas it's uh it feels cohesive it feels holistic uh what i do i can see a direct result of yeah that's what that's what i'll say for benefits and responsibility and john farley yeah i would uh kind of echo what nicole said uh just kind of investment both the company investing in its employees and also the employee investment in their work um certainly at you know in my previous job there was very much just a punch-the-clock mentality of just you know you're here to do your job and then go home and you know call it a date and not really feeling rewarded or you know satisfied with what's going on there versus now yeah very much invested in in the work because we see the benefits of that at the end of the month at the end of the year uh at the end of the day really um and having that you know with the company investing in their employees with training and different programs we can do for that and yeah very much just showing up and uh and working hard and seeing the benefits of that feeling uh yeah feeling it yeah okay great and uh maybe john farley continuing with that you know we've been hearing uh the benefits that all of you have been sharing the responsibilities the opportunities so with this great resignation and great reshuffle what do you think about is the eot at least part of the answer to addressing some of the dissatisfaction that employees are are talking about sure yeah certainly for me uh again coming from the previous company say here it's it's certainly a night and day difference there um you know it's funny at optimax uh we've actually grown during during the pandemic we've actually been thriving during the pandemic uh strangely enough we uh we're continuing to hire we're on a pretty big hiring sphere right now we're adding another i think 60 000 square foot addition onto the building here so certainly whatever we're doing seems to be working um it's it's definitely headed in the right direction that way for us compared to what i've seen in the past uh nicole how about you yeah i think that um the eot is a brilliant solution to the great resignation and um everyone who feels that way towards their jobs and work i mean the increase in pay the investment towards the job and then again the investment back towards the employee just feeling valued and what it brings to you mentally versus just the physical job i think that all of those are are what people are looking for in their work-life balance i think it'd be really appealing um alternative to a traditional job and john forsythe yeah so the great resignation i mean i think people have always wanted to have ownership to be able to own partially what they produce and to share in the wealth and build equity and you know and not just be exploited and go home and live paycheck to paycheck and i think people are tired of it i think the great resignation is a large sign that people want a change that i think i mean i think in society generally there's we're just going undergoing so much change and these work environments have to change with it and and the eot is really customizable so it can be resilient in the face of um adversity or sudden changes like we saw with the pandemic so yeah i definitely think that eot is a great solution to and and the sign of the trend moving towards employee ownership i think the workplace should be democratized words of professor richard wolff i'm i'm really familiar with his work and he's really pushing for co-ops um you know the eot isn't very well known yet but i'm sure he would expand on that if you learned about what it is um so yeah i think i think this trend is going to continue because people are kind of fed up for lack of a better phrase um yeah so i think that's i think this trend is going to continue into towards employee ownership the descriptions that all of you give it just it sounds so amazing and it's nice to hear it from the employee side as well as the employer side you know to see is this really matching matching up you know and from all accounts that i've come across so far um you know it just is uh it offers some really positive change that just isn't available you know in the way that that businesses are typically typically run and it's uh you know with only to my best estimation about 30 eots in the us at this time that of course they're more popular in the in the uk they're very popular there but all of you are part of the movement and you know just being part of the change by being a part of it and doing things like uh sharing your experience here so thank you for that and let's take a turn here and look at some questions that have been submitted and if anybody has any questions who's listening in the live stream go ahead and put those in the chat but this one comes in for nicole wendy says congratulations on your elevation to vice president of your company what comes next she says do you think uh changing to the eot helped you uh climb within your company faster yes certainly um wendy thank you for your question and being interested in us i think it's definitely um helped me achieve a higher role in a smaller amount of time and as much as i love this role and the responsibility and as much as it's needed to be filled i think it works in both ways so you know people are always wanting um to do more usually are wanting more responsibility just more investment and like i said before the and the company wants to invest in its employees so it's certainly helped me a lot and i'm i'm thrilled about it and i think everyone else are getting um opportunities as well that's exciting yeah it's really really awesome okay and uh next question optimax seems like a great company are your friends jealous of the experience you're having at optimax as an eot and if any apply to the company after hearing about it from you uh that's that's a great question um i don't know that any of my friends have technically applied yet but um yes i'm sure they're all very jealous certainly of the profit sharing program um when they see those bonus checks rolling every month everybody's still jealous of that so that was john farley john forsythe how about you uh honestly i i'm not very vocal about my work but yeah i mean if a lot of my friends are still in georgia still have yet to get out and meet people here in portland oregon but the the minimum wage in oregon is abysmal i think the federal minimum wage is like 7.25 and i don't think that's changed in quite some time so if they heard about what i'm getting paid yeah yes they would be jealous excellent excellent thank you and then our last one that i have here uh this is for john farley um so tom says optimax is a very technical uh you know innovation-driven company and uh the question is whether you think that the eot drives um innovation in technology you know more than a company that isn't an eot yeah i would say for sure um you know i said part one of the tenants of the eot is to continue to grow the business and continue to improve the technology and we have a pretty large uh research and development uh team here that's always looking to advance the technology um you know certainly you know being in rochester or the rochester area in new york you know we've seen kodak and xerox and a lot of companies like that that sort of got stagnant and uh sort of fell by the wayside so we're always looking to innovate and continue to grow in that direction well that's super interesting i mean you know because i'm the director of the entrepreneurship center here at santa barbara city college and it just seems like entrepreneurial skills are just such a good fit for working within the company you know being able to identify problems come up with solutions you know collaborate uh to test things out you know that the that entire skill set um so it's really kind of exciting because i think this demonstrates for our students that you know it isn't just that you have to start your own business in order to be innovative in order to be entrepreneurial you know so um yeah it sounds like you're all doing amazing uh work and we're actually almost at the end of our time let's close with uh what would be the top recommendation for others who want to seek employment with an eot yeah great um i would say just search for a company that is invested in its employees that's invested in you your career path you know how you work how you would fit in just someone that values their employees versus someone that's looking to just put a filler in place to punch a time clock um all those qualities are gonna point you towards a more eot um if not an actual eot company but one that has the same values okay great john foresight yeah everything nicole just said look for a company that has those values um and i think you could even introduce the idea of where you currently work to introduce the idea of selling to your employees through an eot exit if that is i i think that would be um because they probably don't even realize that that's an option if they're looking to keep the company and uh have it you know keep going when they're gone eot is a great solution and they can exit through their employees that way that doesn't work you can look up employee owned registries in your area [Music] and i think the real entrepreneurial thing is to start your own eot really want to work in the employee environment that's right equity atlas proved it can be done yeah excellent okay and john farley yeah i would just kind of repeat the same things that they said you know it really comes down to the values of the company that you're working for there's a lot of optics companies in the rochester area and as i was looking uh to move out in this direction i looked at quite a few of them and um you could tell just from from talking to the people automatic even just reading on the website the way that they invest in their employees the way that they care about you know making sure everybody's staying moving forward and growth in their life is certainly a big attractor so looking for places like that i think it's a great place to start yes so i yeah i would um just echo both equity atlas and optimax you know i did research on your companies of course before the podcast series and it was so clear you know how employee-centric they are how much they are standing behind and backing up their employees and really working to create an amazing experience and change in in the uh market you know in the business world you know so um it's it's so exciting thank you uh to all of you for joining us for the finale of this podcast series nicole elias of montecito estate management john farley of optimax and john forsythe of equity atlas please check the video links below uh the video for links to these companies and other resources and for our audience if you are a business owner in santa barbara county who thinks you might be ready to grow your business maybe even form an eot or any other growth initiative be sure to tune in next week because we're going to announce an amazing opportunity that's taking place this summer so you don't want to miss it all right thanks so much again to the three of you and have a great week everyone